Battery preservation

harrytherid

harrytherid

Full Member

Messages
60
Hi you battery experts. How do I look after a new battery until needed?
Last time out I was in the midlands for a few days of icy cold dull weather. Running the Truma boiler/heater, and not a great deal else, my two 110AH batteries and 80W solar panel could not cope. I decided I needed new batteries. When I got home I ordered a 110AH Banner which I was not in a position to fit for a few days.
Then came the forum question of "Battery Charging". I learned that I know little about it and that some of you seem to know a lot. On reading all, I followed the advice on checking batteries and discovered that there is probably little wrong with my existing batteries, possibly a little wrong with the McLouis' charger and possibly a lot wrong with the position of one of my batteries (below the floor in an un-insulated box, soon to become an insulated box when I can get to it).
My problem now is that I have a new battery in my garage sat there until I eventually need it. How do I look after it so that it is in as good condition as possible when eventually it is decided to fit it. The two in the wagon are both showing 13.3volts with the McLouis' charger on mains power and seem to be maintaining that voltage (certainly over 12V) for a few days at least when taken off power. The charger I have in my garage is a very old (about 35 years) 6 amp mains charger which has always done the job when time and accident has caused a flat battery in the car. The MH starter battery is kept up to scratch when at home by switching the solar panel over to it.
I have probably failed to pre-answer and important question but hopefully not.
Yours Harry
 
My brother in law works on the theory that if something is going to be needed eventually then he may as well get it now and get the use of it. So on that basis I would get a second new banner and fit them both.
 
If you are going to keep it in the garage you should keep it fully charged as if flat can freeze and split the case. Chargers have changed a lot in 35 years. I have recently bought a 7 stage charger that is very cleaver. It has all sorts of functions that you wont have on you old charger. https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/12V-2-4-...e=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649

Of course you can charge up using you old battery charger but don't over charge battery and give it a top up charge every 2-3 months, winter-summer.

At some point you should get your old batteries tested to see if ok. and or make sure your system is up to scratch. I purchased on of these https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/12V-Car-...e=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649 I am an ex vehicle electrician so to me these thing will get used on various vehicles.:D
 
TBH, I would consign the 35 year old charger to the cupboard of doom that most people have and never use again.
Get a reason Smart Charger to replace it that will do service when needed on the car AND also can be left on the Leisure Batteries as long as you need and want to and will no cause any damage if you forget (unlike the old charger I would bet).

Lots of Battery Chargers around that claim to be Smart Chargers, but like many things, you get what you pay for.
This EXPLORER (ex PICO) unit from Alpha Batteries is very well constructed - https://www.alpha-batteries.co.uk/12v-10a-connect-forget-leisure-battery-charger/
CTEK are a well respected brand for chargers - this is their 5A model - https://amzn.to/2Sq4XpX
Victron are another top make - This unit: https://amzn.to/2UUgBGa will let you monitor and set it up via a Bluetooth App. This may sound like a gimmick but it really is a useful feature and IMO is worth chosing over the similar price and spec CTEK.

You say "13.3volts with the McLouis' charger on mains power" - sounds reasonable for a float charge, but here is a question ... does it ever go ABOVE 13.3V?
A lot of Motorhome battery chargers just put out a constant voltage regardless of battery needs and so do not actually charge the batteries correctly. Putting out a constant 13.3V is no better for the battery than putting out a constant 14.4V - both are detrimental to battery longevity.
 
Alf said:
Lidl have a good Smart charger on offer on the 14th of February its only £12.99 it has a Trickle charge or maintenance charge setting.

Alf
Click to expand...
That is a good unit. I've been waiting for it to come back as I had to take the last one back as it kept turning off.
 
Lots on ebay,numax are good £45 and there is a chinese model at very little money £14 which im sure are the same as numax and all are smart.
Just cut the clips of and wire in to battery circuit with a inline fuse.

40ah charger.jpgnumax 10a.png
 
wildebus said:
That is a good unit. I've been waiting for it to come back as I had to take the last one back as it kept turning off.
Click to expand...
I don't know if that is a good recommendation.:eek::D Was it meant to turn off or was it supposed to switch to maintenance charge setting. I know I looked at the Lidl one in the past and decided against it, I thought it was probably a very good charger for the price but I think you had to set it up each use. I had thoughts of fitting it as a second in vehicle mains charger. If the power cut off with the type I have the unit remembers the settings and re-starts with the same set up, when the power back on.:) Thanks for the info by the way.:D
 
trevskoda said:
Lots on ebay,numax are good £45 and there is a chinese model at very little money £14 which im sure are the same as numax and all are smart.
Just cut the clips of and wire in to battery circuit with a inline fuse.
Click to expand...

It appears that both of these are 3 stage chargers. Both I'm sure have their good points but I will stick with my 7 stage. The blue one I think would be useful if you wanted a quick charge and had a big battery bank. I know when I looked around some makers claimed that there chargers were fully automatic but they said once battery fully charged disconnect charger, they went in trickle charge mode which is not a maintenance charge, trickle charge will damage the battery and boil it dry if continually left on. So please be aware and read the small print.:)

EDIT The 40 amp unit come up at about £88.00. But Lidl 5 amp listed below is £13.99 from Sunday.*****:D:D:D
 
Last edited:
chas142 said:
I don't know if that is a good recommendation.:eek::D Was it meant to turn off or was it supposed to switch to maintenance charge setting. I know I looked at the Lidl one in the past and decided against it, I thought it was probably a very good charger for the price but I think you had to set it up each use. I had thoughts of fitting it as a second in vehicle mains charger. If the power cut off with the type I have the unit remembers the settings and re-starts with the same set up, when the power back on.:) Thanks for the info by the way.:D
Click to expand...
When the Battery was full, the charger turned off so was no good for maintenance. My understanding of the unit and from others with this charger is that that should not happen.
I don't regard a product failing as indicative of a bad product - just one of those things that can happen and Lidl branded gear is generally excellent (and is warranted for 3 years anyway, don't forget)
 
I thought the OP was wanting a smart charger to just put a maintenance charge in the battery in his garage the Lidl unit would be OK for that.Yes the disadvantage of both the Lidl and Aldi units they do loose the settings on loosing power and need turning on again and the charge type resetting, not such a bad thing for a home charger at a fraction of the cost of the very expensive Smart chargers.

Alf




chas142 said:
I don't know if that is a good recommendation.:eek::D Was it meant to turn off or was it supposed to switch to maintenance charge setting. I know I looked at the Lidl one in the past and decided against it, I thought it was probably a very good charger for the price but I think you had to set it up each use. I had thoughts of fitting it as a second in vehicle mains charger. If the power cut off with the type I have the unit remembers the settings and re-starts with the same set up, when the power back on.:) Thanks for the info by the way.:D
Click to expand...
 
I think that was the confusing bit and why I didn't get one, cuts off or not? great for a bench charger but as you say, no good for maintenance. Yes good warranty and a good price.:)
 
Alf said:
I thought the OP was wanting a smart charger to just put a maintenance charge in the battery in his garage the Lidl unit would be OK for that.Yes the disadvantage of both the Lidl and Aldi units they do loose the settings on loosing power and need turning on again and the charge type resetting, not such a bad thing for a home charger at a fraction of the cost of the very expensive Smart chargers.

Alf
Click to expand...
Yes agreed, have you got one and does it cut of when fully charged? Doesn't tell you on the Lidl site, but good for the price 4 stage by the looks of it.:D
 
Last edited:
If I remember right you can select a range of charging options and at the end of each the charging led changes colour and revert to a maintainace charge the instructions a minimal I will see if I can find mine.

Alf

chas142 said:
Yes agreed, have you got one and does it cut of when fully charged? Doesn't tell you on the Lidl site, but good for the price 4 stage by the looks of it.:D
Click to expand...
We
 
While looking on the Lidl site earlier I also saw that they are selling a battery, starter and charging tester, I think it was £2.99. It's one of the LED traffic light types. I wont be buying one, (have something much better listed above), but if you haven't got anything in your tool box to do this for the price it will hopefully tell you something.
 
Aldi or Lidl charger.

Alf kindly supplied a brochure of his Aldi charger, I didn't like it as it said it switched to trickle charge at the end of charge, it also didn't have a setting for Gel batteries, as such, sorry Alf perhaps I was a bit harsh on it on that bit. As I said details may have been lost in the translation.

Anyways looking at the Lidl Site and their car battery chargers in the manuals section. I was quite surprised and the numbers of battery chargers they have sold over the years, to note is that there are lots of different models of the same looking charger. I pulled up this one as it looks like the version that is on sale from Sunday, https://www.lidl-service.com/static/2929605641/296069_EN.pdf

This is product code IAN 296069 There are lots of other products versions with different specifications, (I suspect), I don't know if the version on sale is this one and you would need to read the manual to make sure it the same or similar.

This shows this version as a 7 stage 5 amp charger, it has switchable settings for 6v & 12v motorcycle, 12v car & 12v car AGM / Winter charge @14.7 volts.

It switches to:- Retention charge As described under programmes, this appliance features the automatic retention charge. Depending on the voltage drop of the battery, caused by self discharge, the appliance reacts with different charge currents. The battery can remain connected to the charger for longer periods of time.

I would recommend this model of Lidl charger, at £13.99 you can't go wrong. Thanks Alf for pointing us down this route.

Edit. The one in Lidi at the moment is a 7 stage, it says so on the box. I didn't buy one but I did pick it up and put it down again 3 times. I already have 5 chargers of various types. You could use it on Gel batteries as one setting is 14.4v.
 
Last edited:
harrytherid said:
Hi you battery experts. How do I look after a new battery until needed?
Last time out I was in the midlands for a few days of icy cold dull weather. Running the Truma boiler/heater, and not a great deal else, my two 110AH batteries and 80W solar panel could not cope. I decided I needed new batteries. When I got home I ordered a 110AH Banner which I was not in a position to fit for a few days.
Then came the forum question of "Battery Charging". I learned that I know little about it and that some of you seem to know a lot. On reading all, I followed the advice on checking batteries and discovered that there is probably little wrong with my existing batteries, possibly a little wrong with the McLouis' charger and possibly a lot wrong with the position of one of my batteries (below the floor in an un-insulated box, soon to become an insulated box when I can get to it).
My problem now is that I have a new battery in my garage sat there until I eventually need it. How do I look after it so that it is in as good condition as possible when eventually it is decided to fit it. The two in the wagon are both showing 13.3volts with the McLouis' charger on mains power and seem to be maintaining that voltage (certainly over 12V) for a few days at least when taken off power. The charger I have in my garage is a very old (about 35 years) 6 amp mains charger which has always done the job when time and accident has caused a flat battery in the car. The MH starter battery is kept up to scratch when at home by switching the solar panel over to it.
I have probably failed to pre-answer and important question but hopefully not.
Yours Harry
Click to expand...
I would recommend about 300 watts of solar panel if mounted horizontally to keep pace with moderate habitation usage in low sun and short winter daylight hours. I'm sure your new batteries when fitted will have more usability in them than your outgoing ones.
 
Yes, with two 110ah batteries and only 80 watts of solar that's your main problem there. I would go with a rough ratio of twice the amount of solar watts as battery Ah in summer and as Rob H says could even go to three times if a high power user, or to cover winter use. Also you should replace both batteries at the same time (if you meant two leisure, not one leisure & one starter). You might be better off getting one good quality deep discharge battery rather than two cheap ones that cant take a deep discharge. Read this site:

http://www.**************************/battery-technology.php
 
You need to work out what your useage is really. 1000w of solar mounted flat wouldn’t keep up with usage for us in winter but we are mainly electric apart from job and grill and use our motorhome a lot all year round.

I went for 2x150w panels and 3x90amp powerframe batteries and for maybe 8 months of the year I am fine, may be better than that now I have the B2B as well.

Once you know your useage check space on roof if roof mounting and work out wgat the best you can fit is. You can get large panels a lot cheaper now so maybe one or two around 250/300w. You don’t need to put them all on at once as budget comes in to it as well. Get a good solar controller (MPPT) and size that for what you intend to have when budget allows so you don’t have to buy again.

If you are a heavy power user and use your van a lot in the UK flat panels will not provide what you need to keep you off grid but you should easily manage to last til your cassette needs emoting then book a night on a site to empty out, recharge and long hot showers and laundry, works for us :)
 
wfdTamar said:
Yes, with two 110ah batteries and only 80 watts of solar that's your main problem there. I would go with a rough ratio of twice the amount of solar watts as battery Ah in summer and as Rob H says could even go to three times if a high power user, or to cover winter use. Also you should replace both batteries at the same time (if you meant two leisure, not one leisure & one starter). You might be better off getting one good quality deep discharge battery rather than two cheap ones that cant take a deep discharge. Read this site:

http://www.**************************/battery-technology.php
Click to expand...

Good advice and good information from attached link, I purchased a https://www.alpha-batteries.co.uk/12v-110ah-leoch-powabloc-tubular-gel-battery/ It's not on the list but it is a new battery, I think, expensive at £199, but 6 years warranty, perhaps 2000 cycles to 50% DOD. Remember 5% discount with code. My last German Gel lasted 18 years. Lots of info also at alpha on all sorts of batteries.:D But OP was about how to keep his none fitted battery in condition while in garage.

Looking at chargers above and the latest Lidl charger was very good, see post 16, for an off vehicle charger. Also found a on ebay https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/10A-12V-...ulti-stage-mains-battery-charger/122763860369 on discount for next week. May get one of these to supplement my on board system. :D Batteries and Chargers:D:cool::cool::LOL::LOL:
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Users who viewed this discussion (Total:0)

Back
Top