How Safe are our vehicles, in particular EVs?

[GeoffL]

Since when did any car do 60mpg, 30/40 if lucky on a good day with a tail wind.

That might be the case for Skodas driven with a heavy right foot. It was the case for a 1993 Volvo 850 2.5 10-valve I once owned. Two previous Volvos (both 740s) would only give 30 mpg on a good day. However, my current car (Nissan Qashqai J10 1.5 dci) returns approx 62 mpg according to the trip computer and the previous one (2004 VW Touran 2.0 TDi Sport Auto) returned over 58 mpg and got 65 mpg on one long trip (although I admit to sitting in lane 1 for hours on end and keeping pace with the HGVs just to see how far I could stretch it!)

There again, very few EVs manage 3.5 miles per kWh.

You might be correct -- but then I was trying hard to put EVs in best light. 'The Internet' suggests that the 'thirstiest' of EVs return about 2.5 mpkWh and the most frugal (claimed to be a variant of the Tesla Model 3) returns 4.54 mpkWh. I suspect the articles I found didn't consider things like Ford's EV pickups (e.g. F150 Lightning [~2.1 mpkWh]), the EV Hummer [~1.55 mpkWh] and (at the other extreme) with a claimed 10 mpkWh and fitted with solar panels that can add 4 kWh or more per day, the Aptera.

ᐅ Electric Car Mileage - How Good Are Modern EVs Really?

Electric car mileage & consumption | What is a good EV consumption rate & range? | What are the best EVs currently on the market | Read more!

justwe-gpi.com

[...] with a cheap home charging rate of 4.5p/kWh and one car getting free supercharging I am quids in compared with diesel.

... but only because of subsidies. Basically, EV drivers who are getting those home charging rates are leeching off the rest of society. If electricity was taxed the same as hydrocarbon fuel (i.e. additional tax levied on road use) home charging would probably be similarly priced to public chargers of the same rating. AIUI, Tesla 'free' supercharging for new cars isn't free, but is reflected in the price/lease. For older cars, Tesla offered 'for life free charging' as an incentive to shift cars that almost nobody wanted -- and it worked. However, how long that lasts and whether it's transferrable depends upon various factors (i.e. caveat emptor and anyone considering a used Tesla needs to check this).

Tesla Supercharging FAQ

Ultimate Tesla supercharging FAQ. We tell you what you need to know

tesla-info.com

 

[tonybvi]

There again, very few EVs manage 3.5 miles per kWh.

60mph is easily possible. We recently had a hire car. I think it was a VW polo, it was petrol, anyway. I didn't drive it gently and it did just over 55mpg.

Do you actually run an EV? I can tell you from experience that my Tesla Model X that I have been running for 4 years and 35000miles returns easily 3miles /kWh in Summer (it has achieved 3.5 on several longer journeys) and 2.5 in winter. Bear in mind this is one of the bigger EVs around. My Fiat 500e easily returns 4miles /kWh after 6 months of ownership and 3000 miles.

 

[Pudsey Bear]

Since when did any car do 60mpg, 30/40 if lucky on a good day with a tail wind.

Ours did 63 when we got it, but we're down to about 56 on average, but any car with a MPG gauge will do 99mpg all day if you find a hill long enough.

There are much better ones though

Top 10 most fuel-efficient cars to buy in 2023 - cinch

Hybrid, turbocharger and electric technology are helping to make petrol and diesel engines more efficient than ever

www.cinch.co.uk

 

[trevskoda]

There again, very few EVs manage 3.5 miles per kWh.

60mph is easily possible. We recently had a hire car. I think it was a VW polo, it was petrol, anyway. I didn't drive it gently and it did just over 55mpg.

My car is ment to do 60 mpg, lucky if driving easy it returns 45mpg, my best ever was a trip to devon in a old rear engine soda and i got 52mpg for the first fill until i got fed up and gave it the wellie.

 

[trevskoda]

Do you actually run an EV? I can tell you from experience that my Tesla Model X that I have been running for 4 years and 35000miles returns easily 3miles /kWh in Summer (it has achieved 3.5 on several longer journeys) and 2.5 in winter. Bear in mind this is one of the bigger EVs around. My Fiat 500e easily returns 4miles /kWh after 6 months of ownership and 3000 miles.

4 years and only 35000 miles, they say anything under 12th a year you would be better to get a taxi, i seen me do over 40th in one year with my old sodas

 

[Pudsey Bear]

My car is ment to do 60 mpg, lucky if driving easy it returns 45mpg, my best ever was a trip to devon in a old rear engine soda and i got 52mpg for the first fill until i got fed up and gave it the wellie.

Was the welly to cover the holes in the floor?

 

[trevskoda]

Was the welly to cover the holes in the floor?

£100 car and went very long distance, twise to devon and home nay bother.

 

[2cv]

Interesting to see how they deal with EV fires in Belgium;

Where a 'normal' #carfire is a matter of extinguishing and hauling away, a fire in a #hybrid car is a much more complicated job. That was confirmed again yesterday when we were called for #smokontwikkeling in a hybrid vehicle in #Leuven.

When we arrived at the scene, we detected a strong smoke development, which was due to the 'thermal runaway' of the battery. This happens when the temperature of a battery cell rises significantly. Shortly after arrival, flames were already visible. After knocking down the flames, we cooled the vehicle abundantly and placed it in a special #waterdompelcontainer.

After all, a damaged battery can catch fire again even after abundant cooling due to a chemical reaction in the battery. In order to stop this reaction, it is necessary to cool the battery for a very long time. For this we use a special container in which the vehicle can be submerged for a longer period.

The container was placed on a remote parking lot. Once the vehicle is completely cooled, a towing service will remove it from the container and drive it to the scrap dealer. Not because of drowning, but because such a car is completely destroyed anyway when the battery catches fire.

There was also the necessary attention for the extinguishing water. After all, it's polluted and we couldn't let it go away. It was captured in underground rainwater tanks and will be checked prior to processing.

 

[GeoffL]

Anyone who follows The MacMaster knows that he has a Porsche Taycan EV that's pretty much destroying his life. He recently returned from a holiday to Spain to find the 12v battery was flat and he couldn't even get into the car the normal way. It seems that this is a common issue. He had to find a 'manual key' to open the door and then found everything was dead. He phoned up Porsche Support, who arranged for the AA to attend in a few hours. In the meantime, he'd (by instinct?) closed the door and now couldn't open it. Of course, the 'manual key' was also trapped inside, in his pocket! So he had to get his ex-wife to retrieve the second 'manual key' to let him out...
Unfortunately, I suspect that this issue isn't confined to EVs and feel confident that there are ICEV models with the same issue. IMO, any vehicle that only has an electronic door opening from inside isn't safe.

 

[We Luv Freedom]

We watched the clip last night & sorry Macmaster but we had to laugh as u couldnt really make it up,,,, Shame it dpesnt make Main Stream Media ,,,, An earlier Macmaster clip states he bought the Porsche for £110,000 + & now worth less than £60,000 ,,, after 12mths ,,, Correct us if we are wrong ,,,,

 

[Pudsey Bear]

Our Fiesta locked me out last year, I unlocked it, tossed the key on the seat went to the tailgate and neighbour spoke to me, we chatted for a few minutes the light flashed, the mirrors folded and it locked itself, fortunately we do have spare keys or that might have been expensive if we'd been far from home.

 

[maingate]

That might be the case for Skodas driven with a heavy right foot. It was the case for a 1993 Volvo 850 2.5 10-valve I once owned. Two previous Volvos (both 740s) would only give 30 mpg on a good day. However, my current car (Nissan Qashqai J10 1.5 dci) returns approx 62 mpg according to the trip computer and the previous one (2004 VW Touran 2.0 TDi Sport Auto) returned over 58 mpg and got 65 mpg on one long trip (although I admit to sitting in lane 1 for hours on end and keeping pace with the HGVs just to see how far I could stretch it!)

You might be correct -- but then I was trying hard to put EVs in best light. 'The Internet' suggests that the 'thirstiest' of EVs return about 2.5 mpkWh and the most frugal (claimed to be a variant of the Tesla Model 3) returns 4.54 mpkWh. I suspect the articles I found didn't consider things like Ford's EV pickups (e.g. F150 Lightning [~2.1 mpkWh]), the EV Hummer [~1.55 mpkWh] and (at the other extreme) with a claimed 10 mpkWh and fitted with solar panels that can add 4 kWh or more per day, the Aptera.

ᐅ Electric Car Mileage - How Good Are Modern EVs Really?

Electric car mileage & consumption | What is a good EV consumption rate & range? | What are the best EVs currently on the market | Read more!

justwe-gpi.com

... but only because of subsidies. Basically, EV drivers who are getting those home charging rates are leeching off the rest of society. If electricity was taxed the same as hydrocarbon fuel (i.e. additional tax levied on road use) home charging would probably be similarly priced to public chargers of the same rating. AIUI, Tesla 'free' supercharging for new cars isn't free, but is reflected in the price/lease. For older cars, Tesla offered 'for life free charging' as an incentive to shift cars that almost nobody wanted -- and it worked. However, how long that lasts and whether it's transferrable depends upon various factors (i.e. caveat emptor and anyone considering a used Tesla needs to check this).

Tesla Supercharging FAQ

Ultimate Tesla supercharging FAQ. We tell you what you need to know

tesla-info.com

I recently read that the Nissan diesel engine is not that good. You might want to google why.

The Ford 1.5 diesel also got poor reviews. I believe Ford intend to discontinue it or already have.

 

[Pudsey Bear]

Our Fiesta has the 1.5 Ford diesel, it seems to be a decent engine but is built for economy not speed.

 

[trevskoda]

Our Fiesta has the 1.5 Ford diesel, it seems to be a decent engine but is built for economy not speed.

Worked 40 years on cars and never seen any good ford engine except the banana, had x flows in my kitcar, total sh one t.

 

[Pudsey Bear]

Doesn't really matter if they scrap em after 3 years over there does it ours has 74k on it so far, had it 3 years had to have 2 new springs cos the roads are crap.

 

[GeoffL]

I recently read that the Nissan diesel engine is not that good. You might want to google why.

I did and, while there are some problems, consensus seems that it's nothing proper servicing can't resolve and most of the problems are associated with short trips and low-speed, urban driving (which we rarely do). Just to be clear, my car has the 2009 Renault engine. I've included a link, but it would be interesting to see what you've found. That said, I suspect there hasn't been a car made that's completely problem-free.

Nissan Qashqai 1.5 dCi Engine Problems: Explained

In this article, we'll be exploring the most commonly reported Nissan Qashqai 1.5 dCi engine problems and answer your most common questions.

autozilla.co.uk

 

[maingate]

I did and, while there are some problems, consensus seems that it's nothing proper servicing can't resolve and most of the problems are associated with short trips and low-speed, urban driving (which we rarely do). Just to be clear, my car has the 2009 Renault engine. I've included a link, but it would be interesting to see what you've found. That said, I suspect there hasn't been a car made that's completely problem-free.

Nissan Qashqai 1.5 dCi Engine Problems: Explained

In this article, we'll be exploring the most commonly reported Nissan Qashqai 1.5 dCi engine problems and answer your most common questions.

autozilla.co.uk

The same article I read praised the Nissan petrol engines, so it's not all bad.

Renault diesels have had a good reputation for a lot of years. I had 2 Clios with the 1.9 diesel. The first one was an absolute flying machine and I could be doing nearly 90 mph if I lost concentration. The second one was less nippy as they tamed the later diesels and the last one had the smaller diesel probably similar to yours. I also sometimes drove a Renault van with the 2.2 diesel and despite regularly overloading it, it was an excellent workhorse.

Short trips and urban driving is why I gave up on diesels after many years of having nothing else. I got my 1.2 petrol Skoda Roomster over 9 years ago and still have it. We have had several trips to various Dealers to look at new ones but found nothing we liked.

 

[GeoffL]

Another EV fire -- this time near St Austell, Cornwall. I first read about this on Cornwall Live; where they just said it was a "car fire" and, TBH, the photos weren't definitive. However, YouTuber "Geoff Buys Cars" has dug deeper and it turns out this was a Vauxhall Vivaro Electric that had been supplied under the Motability scheme and modified to be wheelchair compatible. The family habitually plugged the van into their charge point when they got home but didn't energise the charge point until after 23:30, when their discounted tariff kicked in. So the van was plugged in, but not being charged when it caught fire. I've linked the video. Another issue that Geoff pointed out is that on some occasions it's been the charger, not the EV, that's caught fire and that it's common for chargers to be installed right next to front doors -- so denying an escape route should the charger catch fire